^^ you're joking right?

Those civic weights are definitely dry weights, and are wrong. The VX is lighter than the CX, DX and Si(atleast from every other chart I've seen in the past). The SRT4 isn't 2900lbs unless its fully loaded with all fluids. Dry weight is much less.

As for the hp/vs torque thing, you do know how gear ratio effects torque actually making it to the wheels right??? And that a shorter gear multiplies torque more than a long gear... So your low torque car with short gearing is probably putting the same amount of torque to the wheels as a higher torque car with long gearing. Traction doesn't depend on how much power the engine is making, it depends on how much torque is being applied to the wheels.

I won't even start on the tranny falling apart thing, I'd love to know where you got the 375whp figure though... Theres TONS of them making a ton more power than that that aren't blowing up trannies. Its also not hp that breaks stuff, its torque.. Same force that moves the car, and I bet the 600whp GSR is making less torque than a 400whp SRT4 engine.

*edit* - found your source for those weights.. Nice work not including this:

These cars were weighed BONE STOCK.
This means:
No A/C - was NOT std. on any hatchback in 1992
No radio - again radios were NOT std. on ANY hatches in 1992
Only Si had 2 mirrors std. Add the weight of a mirror if you got 2 on your CX/VX/DX
ONLY the Si had powersteering - the DX auto did too, but I didn't list that one. I listed the manual, which had no p/s
Stock wheels. VX had lightweight 13'' alloys, CX/DX had 13'' steels, Si had heaviest 14'' steelies with wheel covers

Compare a typical one, not a stripped down base model with zero options on it..

Originally Posted by neonSRT

^^ you're joking right?

Those civic weights are definitely dry weights, and are wrong. The VX is lighter than the CX, DX and Si(atleast from every other chart I've seen in the past). The SRT4 isn't 2900lbs unless its fully loaded with all fluids. Dry weight is much less.

As for the hp/vs torque thing, you do know how gear ratio effects torque actually making it to the wheels right??? And that a shorter gear multiplies torque more than a long gear... So your low torque car with short gearing is probably putting the same amount of torque to the wheels as a higher torque car with long gearing. Traction doesn't depend on how much power the engine is making, it depends on how much torque is being applied to the wheels.

I won't even start on the tranny falling apart thing, I'd love to know where you got the 375whp figure though... Theres TONS of them making a ton more power than that that aren't blowing up trannies. Its also not hp that breaks stuff, its torque.. Same force that moves the car, and I bet the 600whp GSR is making less torque than a 400whp SRT4 engine.

*edit* - found your source for those weights.. Nice work not including this:



Compare a typical one, not a stripped down base model with zero options on it..

Show me a single high HP turbo car that has an ac system or any options.. most dont have sunroof and only have radios.. which wheigh no more then 50lbs.

I know very much how torque is affected through gearing, torque is also altered through gearing as well. However, the final drive in first gear (first gear multiplied by the final drive of the car, is identical in most vehicles.. these are no exception, and offer the most importance in your 60'

Who cares that a 600whp GSR is making less torque.. its tranny wont blow up and it would destroy the SRT4.

if srt4's are so good then why don't you see hardly any in the nopi and nhra sport compact turbo car events in the street classes?

.... wow some things never change eh.

Originally Posted by Jimmy

if srt4's are so good then why don't you see hardly any in the nopi and nhra sport compact turbo car events in the street classes?

8.62 ET

they also have touring cars

why is the srt4 so hated on? because its fast stock? sure its a neon shell.. its still a good concept from what chrysler did, I don't understand why some of you guys talk so much dirt about them, give it up.. not everyone wants a fast import.

hell to make any civic "fast" you need to dump money into it, some people want a quick car out of the box

and who says the T850 can only handle 375HP?.. well I guess I won't even go there either, just some more people who make quick judgment only because its a chrysler, personally I see alot more faster "STREET LEGAL" srt-4's then I do Hondas, most fast honda's running 11's just get trailer around and have front ends made of fiberglass.

I think this pretty much ends this conversation:

"Lets face it, a motor that creates heavy amounts of torque is much better suited in a vehicle that is heavier, as it can much easier put it down to the ground regardless of gearing."

Originally Posted by spooned civic

.... wow some things never change eh.

hells no not with the mentality of some people, things will never change on here.. its funny to, because most of the crowd who talks shits are the ones who said they were going to "leave" vm permenantly.

Originally Posted by 98BCR

I think this pretty much ends this conversation:

"Lets face it, a motor that creates heavy amounts of torque is much better suited in a vehicle that is heavier, as it can much easier put it down to the ground regardless of gearing."

agreed.

Originally Posted by Trance|Ghost

hells no not with the mentality of some people, things will never change on here.. its funny to, because most of the crowd who talks shits are the ones who said they were going to "leave" vm permenantly.

they'll be back......they always come back

true, oh and just a little info on the nopi white srt-4

Cox and Crawford are doing some amazing things with this car! Some tidbits of information that I found interesting about the SRT-4 engine:

They are putting 825 HP through the engine using the stock block (.096 over bore and block filled with Hard Blok), stock crank, stock head (ported and water ports welded closed), stock bearings, valve seals, lash adjusters, oil system, and ignition coil.

Here are some custom/aftermarket parts they used:
AFX underdrive pulley, Cometic head gasket, custom Crane cam, Crane adjustable cam gears, Crane springs and retainers, T72 turbo, custom header, custom intake, custom fuel rail, 160 lb/hr injectors, 90mm TB, JE pistons, FM rods, etc.

last I check a turbo k series is only pushing what? 500 HP? and thats completely built from what I read.

If you think an SRT-4 swap is too much for a civic, you'll shit bricks from this one:

LS1TECH - newbie...with a ls1....but not in your typical car


Actually, shitting bricks may be a good thing. It'll get things moving down there again, hopefully in the process that stick wedged way the hell up there will dislodge as well. Maybe some bran flakes will help, but I don't know.

It's all pistons in cylinders man, all pistons in cylinders.....

Originally Posted by fixitmattman

If you think an SRT-4 swap is too much for a civic, you'll shit bricks from this one:

LS1TECH - newbie...with a ls1....but not in your typical car


Actually, shitting bricks may be a good thing. It'll get things moving down there again, hopefully in the process that stick wedged way the hell up there will dislodge as well. Maybe some bran flakes will help, but I don't know.

It's all pistons in cylinders man, all pistons in cylinders.....

seen that before....did it end up running good?

Originally Posted by Guess

Show me a single high HP turbo car that has an ac system or any options.. most dont have sunroof and only have radios.. which wheigh no more then 50lbs.

I know very much how torque is affected through gearing, torque is also altered through gearing as well. However, the final drive in first gear (first gear multiplied by the final drive of the car, is identical in most vehicles.. these are no exception, and offer the most importance in your 60'

Who cares that a 600whp GSR is making less torque.. its tranny wont blow up and it would destroy the SRT4.

The SRT4 tranny will hold 500whp no problem, probably more(I haven't read about anyone blowing them apart, but at the same time I haven't been following anyone making numbers in the 600's, so I won't comment).

I totally disagree with the first gear * final drive comment.. Look at the final drive ratio in a GSR tranny(or go nuts and look at an ITR..), its WAY shorter than an SRT4's final drive.. I'm too lazy to look up gear ratio's/final drives for both trannies right now, but I'm not making this up.

As for the weight comment, how much would the civic weigh with a turbo GSR engine in it, compared to a tiny little 1.5 VTEC engine, or 1.6 non-vtec.. Theres easily another 100-200lbs right there(with turbo, piping, IC, etc).

Originally Posted by Trance|Ghost

true, oh and just a little info on the nopi white srt-4

Cox and Crawford are doing some amazing things with this car! Some tidbits of information that I found interesting about the SRT-4 engine:

They are putting 825 HP through the engine using the stock block (.096 over bore and block filled with Hard Blok), stock crank, stock head (ported and water ports welded closed), stock bearings, valve seals, lash adjusters, oil system, and ignition coil.

Here are some custom/aftermarket parts they used:
AFX underdrive pulley, Cometic head gasket, custom Crane cam, Crane adjustable cam gears, Crane springs and retainers, T72 turbo, custom header, custom intake, custom fuel rail, 160 lb/hr injectors, 90mm TB, JE pistons, FM rods, etc.

last I check a turbo k series is only pushing what? 500 HP? and thats completely built from what I read.

you've gotta be fucking retarded...just because someone posts that on the board about 500..the turbo k's that race in nopi some of them make close to 900 to the wheels...and I'm talking about a street car here!!!!

was it just me or was that THE most boring video ever?
i yawned twice.

Originally Posted by rough

was it just me or was that THE most boring video ever?
i yawned twice.

i kept waiting for them to show something other than it idling for 3 minutes
lol

Originally Posted by rough

was it just me or was that THE most boring video ever?
i yawned twice.

no kiddin eh?? wow.. an idiling motor in a car.. whoopie..

Originally Posted by Trance|Ghost

They are putting 825 HP through the engine using the stock block (.096 over bore and block filled with Hard Blok)

so, how is that a stock block?

as far as the video - boring as hell, waste of time and a colossal waste of $$... sure it's different, but the "why" factor is missing... LS1 into a civic, no questions asked.

as far as why everyone hates on srt-4's - if you don't know, me explaining it to you would be useless... If i put a turbo in a K car, would it be cool?

^^yes....it will be a cool K-car

Originally Posted by BLKGSR

as far as why everyone hates on srt-4's - if you don't know, me explaining it to you would be useless... If i put a turbo in a K car, would it be cool?

Yes, it would be cool:

Video - plymouth reliant ( k-car ) Owner Gary Donovan, 4 cylinder, turbo charged, automatic......beats a Toyota Supra........lol......the crowd is hyped!!!!

Plus, being able to say my K-car just smoked your ___________ is just plain awesome.